Human Nature Worldwide: Earth Angels

December 23, 2021

Brooklyn-based designer Malachai Spivey is one to watch. The Brooklyn native began his up-and-coming brand Human Nature Worldwide with himself in mind. His imaginative and off-the-cuff approach to his craft is admirable as he didn’t attend school for design and had little to no mentorship when he began his journey. His brand has been seen on the illustrious Lil Nas X, streetwear it-girl Aleali May, and rapper Coi Leray and many more.

One thing about Malachai’s ethos is that relationships are always at the forefront and status doesn’t define success. The story he wants to tell is one that can only be told by him, so although copies may come, the authenticity will always be lacking. Human Nature Worldwide is the personification of the life of the Flatbush designer and it’s safe to say that we should all be excited to continue watching for what’s next. His most recent brain baby “Earth Angels” was released with a thoughtfulness that shows the designer’s ethos even further.

Text by Kerane Marcellus
Photos by Ryann Ussery

The nostalgia of his pieces, his new collection “Earth Angels”, and the designer's brainwaves are all discussed in an exclusive interview with office.

Check it out below!

How are you? What've you been up to today?

I’m good! I've been working on some new samples I'm doing for the winter. I got some crochet stuff I'm doing. Just some really unique hats and ski masks, sweaters. I'm trying to mix and just make a new style, but I don't want to say because it's kind of a surprise. But I'm probably within the next week or two because I want to start at least dropping the samples that I've been working on. But I feel I'm trying to just go a different way, this the always the lane that I wanted to do is just, I was testing designs this year. And I feel a lot of the designs that I've been holding back on are more of the things that I really want to do. But at the same time, I realized that I had to get people familiar with the brand.

Before I just started overloading with the type of crazy stuff that's in my head so, this year was a lot more simple. I mean, there were still great, great things I'm proud of the work I did this year but, I know that I have a lot more eccentric type things that I want to do. I just wanted people to get an idea of where I'm going with things first before I just put that out there. Like a music artist before they want to drop the album, they have to put the singles out, you know, let you guys feel where I'm going with it.

Have you always been into designing? When did you start?

So, I actually have never gone to school for design or art or any of that, really. I would say since junior high around, 12-13. I mean, I still was very unsure of anything, but especially during that time, that was over 10 years ago. So, a lot of the stuff that's going on now was not even a thought, at that time, so I didn't really know what I was doing. But I've always just seen myself in a different lane and then people I was around and not in an egotistical way of like I feel I'm above you guys. I just feel I was interested in things that were different than what everybody else was into at that time. That's when I kind of just started playing around with my style and just self expression in different ways, painting my nails or dyeing my hair or whatever it was, just doing different things that I felt was pushing the boundary and as I got older and got more confident in myself, I would push them because, things I wanted to do, years ago, but I was afraid to do it because it wasn't as accepted. Even still some of the things I do are not as accepted. I just got more confident in myself. Just with my interests in art and fashion and everything, I didn't know what I wanted to do, but I just knew I needed to be around it. That's when I started going and hanging out in Soho every day, during high school and from there, that's where I got into modeling. And for modeling I did a little bit of styling and styling assisting. So I just always kept myself around, I'm saying around that world, just so I could just soak in that knowledge, because even when I knew that I wanted to start making things, I wanted to be very knowledgeable about everything that I’m doing because, I saw so many people just hop on it just because they can, people say, “Well, you have a platform, just put something out, you can make money,” but my idea of it is not to make money.

I want to make something that can be referenced back to years and years, as we go on. Especially since I don't have any schooling, I didn't have any mentors, besides, a couple people that I was around, but at the same time, and we were all figuring it all out so it's not anybody could really give me the answers on what to do. So, I knew that I had to take my time and just learn everything that I possibly could. You still gotta learn, and you're gonna mess up while you’re still doing it, but I wanted to gain as much knowledge as I can to feel comfortable before I put something out. And then about four years ago I put out my first design. I didn't start the brand yet, but I just wanted to show it. I felt I was finally ready because I had worked on designs years before. I've been working on designs since 2015 but I didn't feel confident in them, and finally, when I made the stacked pants design, that was when I felt confident because this is something original. This is a staple piece and it came directly from my mind. I remember the entire process while I was making it from scratch, even just a fabric size source at that time. I feel I was just taking my time and just trying to hone in on my skills and the knowledge I could and now I've just been going full fledged with it.

When and how did you conceive the idea for Human Nature Worldwide?

So, 2018 is when I started the brand. And I honestly too, that's where, as I was saying, I was finding myself even now I feel finally 2021 I feel I found my niche, style wise, design wise. I found where I feel very comfortable, I found the things that I like. So in 2018, that's around the time, when I started to feel like I wanted to look a certain way but I didn't feel I could find the things to look that way. I want to dress a certain way, I want to have a certain type of aesthetic, but I couldn't find the pieces to fit that especially with the idea or design, I feel like it starts with self.

You're going to create based off of your world. My body type, I'm a very skinny person, but I'm also tall. So, even just as I was a kid, when I wanted to start dressing, I could never really find a great pair of pants that was like the perfect pair of pants to where it can fit my skinny body, but the silhouette of it can fit well also because when a skinny person wears very skinny jeans, it just looks weird like twig legs, I didn't want to have that look. I wanted to have something that could be form fitting, but also, I'm saying just have a silhouette that was a little bit wider so that it could just look better and just, be more of a statement. So that was the idea I was building around when I was designing those pants. I felt like I needed to make everyday pants for myself. So, I just started off sketching and just then I went to the fabric store, I sourced everything. When I came up with that design, and I remember finishing it, I was very confident I felt like I've set the precedent for where I'm trying to go with this. This is a pant that's simple, but it's a statement at the same time and I feel that's a perfect description of just myself. It's everything, whether it's my style, or just even my personality, it's like at first glance, it's basically how you take it, you got to look deeper, just like the same way how people have to get to know me, they may see something on the outside, and then they start to get to know me and start to break down the layers and really look. So, I try to make that same idea with the designs I make.

What’s the ethos of Human Nature Worldwide?

I've only been selling for a little bit over a year now and I remember just thinking about that very hard, because I felt like anytime you hear a brand story it's something super compelling in a way that's like maybe someone died, and this is a representation for them, or somebody experienced something, and this is there inspiration. I caught myself a few times trying to create a story. And I was like, that's not me, because that's not authentic, I don't want to just create something that sounds good just because it sounds good. It has to make sense, especially when I'm explaining it so then I started to really think and that's when going back to what I just said earlier I feel design starts with self. So, I began to realize the story I'm telling through the brand is the story of me. I'm trying to show myself and explain myself, and that's my childhood, my current life, and where I see my life going in the future through my designs. Like the idea of the pants, it brings me back to junior high school when everybody was wearing baggy jeans, the True Religions and it had that stack to it, when you wear the Ugg boots or your Timberlands or whatever, it had that nice stack to it. But being that I was so skinny, it didn't fit me like that. So that’s me referencing back to those days where I loved how those pants fit those guys so now I'm making pants for myself to fit like that or making a leather jacket to, I feel that's the older version of myself, this is how I want to dress when I'm a dad and stuff like that, but still stylish. Even the way I do my photo shoots, a lot of that has to do with my cultural background as well, I'm Trinidadian-American.

Are you first generation?

Second. My mom's mom, they moved, right before my mom was born, so she was born here. All my aunts, uncles, cousins, everybody was born there. And I still have a lot of family there as well. I grew up in that tradition and just the carnival parades, everything, like the costumes, everything, I try to implement that into my designs, my photo shoots, the creative direction I do because, that's a big part of me and what I saw growing up, and I didn't even realize that was a style inspiration for me until I started to really analyze it. But I'm just telling my story. Honestly, I realized that it's hard for that to be kind of understood until you say it because I'm just showing the clothes but then when I explain the details of why I made this piece and why this piece may have this color on it. Each piece has a story to tell and a lot of it is just a story of my life, things that have happened, things I've wanted, things I've envisioned, and it's just all just me telling in that way.

Your designs are pretty otherworldly, especially the Leather Ruched Bondage Pants. What are some inspirations whether music, fashion, or art that have influenced your work?

So, when I’m thinkin of a design, that's one thing I always say is, I try to make my mood boards have no clothing involved because I don't want to reference anyone else's work. I like to reference things where it’s like when you see the reference, now you get it, but it had nothing to do with this. So, I may design a jacket based on a car I saw. I like to reference off of life, and just the things I experience on a daily basis. I'll take a picture of a flower or something and I can use the way that the pink bleeds into the orange on this flower. I do reference style icons like Busta Rhymes, Michael Jackson, those are some of my biggest inspirations but when I look back at them, those are people that can never really be duplicated, because they just kept it so authentic. I try to keep that same idea with how I'm thinking about design. Anytime I think of something, I try to think of it in the most far off way because if this is going to be duplicated, it will be known that it's a duplicate. This is an original thought, so no one can copy it and being copied isn’t my biggest concern at all, I feel like art will always be copied no matter what. That's just inevitable. But I just want to make things that can inspire others.

I love the juxtaposition of the lace and the more streetwear silhouette of your “Earth Angels” project. Tell me more about that process.

Thank you. I love that you pointed that out and picked up on that, because that's the exact idea I'm trying to portray. I feel that's another version of a story of myself, where I grew up. I grew up in Brooklyn, New York, Flatbush specifically, one of the main neighborhoods out here and that streetwear aesthetic is just what I grew up on. Even before younger streetwear brands, like Supreme and stuff that was into tha, I was into stuff like what my pops was putting me onto, like Polo and stuff like that. It's always just had that aesthetic. As I got older, I started to want to push more boundaries, I started to tap into more feminine looks. And I realized that's more of my style. So I wanted to find a healthy balance to where I can mix in that streetwear style that I grew up on, but the feminine style that made me, me. So it's a mix of both of that. I wanted to have pants that could sit like some old True Religions but it's a lace design. When you think of lace, you think of gowns and things like that, so it plays on both sides very, very loudly because that silhouette is very loud on the streetwear side, but that fabric is also very loud on the feminine side. So, I just having the duality of that and I try to mix that in with a lot of my designs and that's why I make the brand unisex because I can wear this but also a girl can wear this and I might even wear that to a wedding just because you can or you can wear it to a party. So, I liked having that duality in the designs.

Who was the celebrity that you’ve seen your designs in that really meant a lot to you?

I would say to this day still, Aleali May is the number one, for multiple reasons. It's crazy how I feel like things come full circle, but I feel like a lot of things are meant to be.I still keep all of my photos up on Instagram, because I like people to see my growth and my story. I have all my photos from high school still up like when Instagram first started, and my first ever photo is still up on my page. The first photo I have is a photo of Aleali, just on some I admire you. She was one of the first stylish girls I knew that was in the culture and just pushing the culture forward. I've just always just been a fan of the things she's done, and just the marks that she's made in the culture. When I first made my designs, the first person I thought of was her. So, I reached out to her. I've never spoken to her, never met her ever but, I just tried to shoot my shot and I just sent her the design. I was like, “Hey, I'm a very big fan of your style and the work you've done and here’s something I just designed. Would you be interested in having it,” and she was like 100% and that was a big confidence boost at that time, because that was the first person I reached out to, the first design I put out, and the reaction that she gave me back was, “Oh my gosh, this is beautiful. I love this.” I think it was a week or two before fashion week when I had messaged her and she was “Yeah, definitely, I'll wear this, during fashion week to a show.”

I was just wowed that this is my first opportunity. She's just very humble, just very authentic. And I feel that's the type of people that when I send out my designs to people and I could have had many more placements with my clothes, but I just prefer personal relationships that's the point of the brand. If I'm telling my story, it can't be told in the wrong light, it has to be told in the right way. It has to be told to people who also share that same mind set and she's always, since day one, been just very authentic, very down to earth. I love that because, she doesn't have to, people would love to send her designs and I'm sure she's getting those messages 100 times a day but the fact that she was so open to doing that, I was like okay, not only one is that great, I appreciate her as a person, but it also gave me confidence that I'm taking the right steps if someone of her stature would want to wear it during fashion week when she's going to be front row at the shows. So, that was just a cool opportunity for me. And since that day, we've just been connected as friends ever since then. And also too, as much stuff I give her, she buys my stuff still and not just texts me to get something. I’ll drop something and I'll see her name is in the orders and didn't even message me about it. She just really supports the brand and these are even things that I'll offer to her. She'll still just go out and purchase it and just like that's real support right there.It's coming from a person who doesn't have to do that, you know? And then she wore it on the show The Hype that we just premiered on HBO. She’s my favorite that I’ve worked with.

Lil Nas X, of course that was one of the biggest.I still have yet to connect with him personally. I want to definitely connect to him personally because I've seen that he clearly is a fan of the brand. That especially makes me feel good when celebrities that I know are seeing multiple looks just even in one day, they can see many looks, and you're repeating looks that I made, that's a confidence boost because clearly you like it. I've seen him in the leather pants many times just on his off days, you know going doing something and I've done customs for him. I feel he's a great person to be my muse with this because it's that same idea of a man that is portrayed as masculine, but also loves to tap into that feminine side.

Who else would you like to see in your designs?

I'm not too big on just big names. It has to be some people I relate to. I can think of three off the top of my head right now. Young Thug, I actually did meet him once, he came to a group pop-up with a couple other brands and he came. I gifted him some of the clothes but it was such a fast exchange, I didn't get to ask him his size and I gave him a size that was a little bit too big for him just assuming because he was tall that I had to give him a large but I forgot that he likes this stuff tight. So I should’ve given him a size small, like what I wear. But he loved it. He was like, “Yo, this stuff is hard, bro.” So, I felt good about it, at least he liked it. At least he didn't waste it because he gave it to this other artist, Yak Gotti. The others, Teezo Touchdown, he's an artist. He does the nails in his hair. I remember I reached out to him even before he blew up. He probably had less than 10,000 followers at the time but I knew he was gonna blow up. I feel like I'll run into him eventually, in real life.

Sahbabii, that's my third. This is just people that I just respect as artists, people that are authentically themselves 100% unapologetically. I'm doing what I want to do. It reminds me of myself in ways that they just kept doing what they wanted to do until people just finally accepted it. A lot of people aren't able to do that, because that takes a lot especially around your peers. The people that you see everyday and hang out with are making fun of you, it doesn't really feel good but eventually once you push through, it ends up paying off. So I just respect those types of people that just are unapologetically themselves, and just show it, regardless of what the outcome may be.

What’s next for Human Nature Worldwide? Would you ever do any fashion shows?

Absolutely, I've been planning by summertime to do my first show. I will say this past year, I took a lot of time, just working on a lot of designs that I knew I wasn't going to release but this is the type of style I want to do for a show. As I was designing this year, I started to learn my market, I started to understand that there's things that I can sell, and then there's runway and I love to design with no boundaries, not in a box. I feel that the runway is the perfect place for that. You have this piece that may not sell because this is not for everyone but this is where you can truly show your mind as an artist and really bring people into your world. Even the music that you're using, the space that you build, I'm bringing you into my mind. I've been working on that this year, I've been designing a lot of pieces. I probably have maybe 30 pieces so far that I have just in samples. Even half of those are probably not even going to use but, it's just getting me in that mindset of more avant garde pieces that I'm not probably not going to sell this, maybe I will but not now, not for the market that I have right now. But this is definitely something I need to show, and that's why even with the “Earth Angels'' collection, that was kind of a taste into where I'm trying to show people where I'm going with it. That's why I made such a small capsule, I made only a few sizes of each, because I knew that that wasn't going to be a heavy seller, but it was great.

People appreciated the artistry of it but it wasn't something that everyone is gonna buy, because everybody doesn't want to look like this but people can appreciate it. It's like a painting, that's why I wanted to create it, this art. I'm not really trying to sell you guys the clothes to show you guys the art. That's why I wanted it to look like old paintings and that whole aesthetic. This year is going to be a lot more lifestyle aspect to the brand in terms of home goods. I basically want to make everything, I want to make furniture, I want to make all of these types of things, and so many of these things I've already been working on, but I want to create my own world through the brand. Like how Nigo did with Bape to where you go to his home is him. Every piece in his home is him, the toys, you can use a toothbrush and it’ll be his design. I want to create everything in that way. And also Virgil was doing that same thing to where even a lot of things I've been seeing his peers share that he never put out but he just was doing it just for the people around him. He was creating his own world and just living in everything that he did. I feel like that's just the total goal of design is to get to that point where you're creating just your own world and everything around it and everything in it. And then you just bring people in. These are all the things that I like but I appreciate that you can like it too. So that's why I want to just bring that light to the brain this year. Just touching every base and leaving no stone unturned.

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After 30 years and over 100 cult fragrances, COMME DES GARÇONS PARFUMS 1994–2025 BY SIMONETT & BAER launches this month

December 17, 2024

“I have to add that the topic is, of course, an irrational one, because it's not art and it's not fashion. It has to do with scent, which is something in the air,” explains Dino Simonett, renowned art-book maker and designer/publisher of the new COMME des GARÇONS x SIMONETT & BAER book, which details 30 years of CDG perfumes.

“The moment you smell something is irrational,” he continues. “This book transports you and brings you to the idea behind the perfumes. People have gotten thousands of art catalogues from me, but this fucking perfume thing really drives people a little bit crazy, you know? Because everybody has this bottle; and that bottle smells like this on them; and this bottle I need; and all the memories and everything. I like it a lot that we made this.”

As fans and family of the world’s coolest brand prepared to gather at Dover Street Parfums Market in Paris to celebrate the launch of the book, our Editor-At-Large Paige Silveria shared some coffee and cigarettes with Simonett to discuss his wild trajectory, making books with Joseph Beuys and Tilda Swinton early on, and the importance of nonconformal thinking.

By Paige Silveria

This fucking perfume thing really drives people a little bit crazy.

Paige Silveria: Tell me about yourself. You make books.

Dino Simonett: My books are my art. Each book might be a painting or sculpture. And you should not do the same sculpture all the time. When you hike somewhere, you never should go the same way back home — this is something my mother taught me when I was young. In the same way, it's boring to make the same stuff all the time. So I try to find a way to invent my own language.

PS: This book you’ve made is really beautiful.

DS: It’s hyperrealistic larger-than-life images of boxes and flacons in an endless row presented on paper the thickness of a children’s book.

PS: I loved how it said in the press release that you woke up one Sunday morning and the idea for the book suddenly came to you.

DS: The backstory is that Remo Hallauer [COO of COMME des GARÇONS International] is a true book lover. We met at the Offprint book fair in Paris. And one day, shortly after peak COVID, this email came from him asking if I’d think about a possible collaboration with one of the young stars here — and no hard feelings, but it didn’t work out. So then, as it is in life, which is the essential thing, you have to have an idea. And most of the time, they’re not good enough. You have to have another and another and then you go, Ah ha! Perfume.

PS: And you’d already been pretty familiar with their fragrances?

DS: I’ve known this stuff since the beginning. I wore the first perfume they created. It was part of my life all the time, and I thought, It's so funny. There’s a connection with how I make the books: like two, three books a year, all collaborations and each is different. Just like their perfumes. So I immediately texted Remo.

PS: And what perfect timing, with the 30-year anniversary.

DS: Yes, but this was two years ago or so. I hadn’t had the jubilee in mind. It might not look like much, but there was a lot of work to do.

PS: Many of the advertisements and images weren’t archived, physically or digitally, right? You had to search all over for a good portion of the material?

DS: Well we also had to wait for the official deal to go through in the beginning. Adrian Joffe [President of COMME des GARÇONS International and Dover Street Market International] wanted to do it but he didn’t have the mind space at the time; they were about to open the Dover Street Market here in Paris. So we were on our own for a bit, developing the project from zero. We looked all over the Internet and tried to create the chronology. I had a young guy helping me. He kept reminding me to be patient and to continue to work on growing the book. The door was open, but we had to wait in front of the next room. So we took little steps to prepare ourselves. And stuff slowly worked out.

PS: And thank God for the Internet.

DS: Yes, because as you mentioned, there was no archive. We thought surely they’d have something in the basement. But no, that didn’t exist. At one point they sent us a list of all the perfumes so we had a clear checklist to manage. I had to become an expert.

PS: There are so many, over 100?

DS: Yeah, and at one point the CDG team was activated. It was like a machine and in the spring suddenly a load of stuff was coming. First we had to grow the grapes, then make the wine and then the grappa. And at the end, it's a really strong grappa. And so things came together, and then one day Adrian said, “All is fine, but Rei [Kawakubo] must now also approve it. This is how the system works.” But nobody had told me! So Remo met with Rei to show her the book.

PS: That’s a bit of pressure!

DS: She could have said no and we’d have to throw everything in the garbage, two years of work. There was indeed a little bit of pressure. But it was fine. She liked the book. Then at the end of this summer we met again and they asked if they could have some of the finished copies on 20 November in Tokyo. I said, “I’m sorry, what?” He was thinking that the book was finished, you know? I told him we still needed a lot of material to finish it. Sometimes it's nice though to have this pressure. It's motivating and thrilling when you finally accomplish it all.

PS: Let’s go back. How did your upbringing inform who you are?

DS: It has to do with nonconformal thinking. Most people think the same. And we’re constantly pressured as well, by everything around us to conform. You have to really fight to keep your head and so I had this upbringing with this rather eccentric mother who was absolutely nonconformistic in every way. She was resolute. Why should we follow the path of the masses? It was never my thing. Voilà.

PS: How were you in school?

DS: I was not so good at school. I was only skateboarding at that time. I was on the Swiss National Team. I even was here in Paris at a European championship when I was 15 at the Trocadero. And my mother said, “You are not going to school anymore. You need an apprenticeship. It makes no sense to send you to school any longer.” I was independent and had my first salary at 16.

PS: What were you doing?

DS: I was a carpenter making tables, chairs, all that stuff. All my friends went to high school with like 16-week holidays, while I had only four. And so it was really, really tough shit for a 16 year old. But I learned two important things. The first one was discipline; seven o'clock each day it started and lasted nine hours. And the second thing was precision; you have to do things right. People always said to me that the apprenticeship was good as I’d really use it for the rest of my life. And I always thought that was such bullshit. But actually, it's kind of true. And so anyways, the moment I finished my apprenticeship, the very last day of the last test, I went on the Interrail for one month and never went back to a carpenter shop.

PS: What’d you do after?

DS: I wrote a letter to this very super famous music guy, Claude Nobs who was organizing the Montreux Jazz Festival in Switzerland, telling him I’d like to work there that summer. I mentioned that I’d just finished my apprenticeship for carpentry. He phoned me back immediately after getting the letter. He said, “Oh you’re a carpenter? You can come right now.” He was renovating his apartment in Montreux. So I stayed and worked there alone while he was up at his chalet. I felt like Kevin McCallister from Home Alone in this completely furnished apartment. And then the festival started, and there was this guy from New York doing a large mural painting. It was Keith Haring. I had no idea who he was. We became friends. Then I met George Benson and Herbie Hancock. It started from nothing and then one thing comes, another thing comes, another thing comes. This is how I started, which is maybe not the natural way. But I was following my intuition and taking chances and putting myself out there.

PS: And you're going after what you have a passion for.

DS: I think that’s the best way to live one's life. It was like my own private art school. I met all the guys I was totally hot about. I met Joseph Beuys and told him I wanted to do an art project with him. I got his number and he told me to ask for his assistant. But I took everything for granted, what people said to me. So I had this phone number in Berlin. And I called the guy 20 times until this fucking meeting with Beuys finally happened. And we met and made a small collaboration art magazine called “Quer.” You just have to stick to the stuff.

PS: Wow. You don't still have one of those copies around, do you?

DS: I had one and I brought it to Remo at one of our meetings. Adrian saw it and immediately took it … I hope he gave it back to Remo. Adrian has a pile of my stuff that he wanted to see, so that’s good.

PS: Yeah, of any coffee table in the world for it to be displayed, his is probably in the top 10.

DS: So then I decided my dream was to be a film director. There was a film school in Berlin that I applied to. They only took about 18 people from 600. We waited all week to see this list on the wall for the final call back meeting. And my name wasn’t there. I was like, “Shit!” And then a week later, I received a letter saying I’d been accepted. Later the director told me it was clear enough with my application and the art magazine I’d sent that I’d be accepted. I don’t say this to brag. I say this to tell you that every young person that wants to go somewhere, all they have to do is fight. You have to get out of your house and your small town and your comfort zone and all that shit.

PS: I agree. So you’ve made films?

DS: I made a feature movie and went to the film festival. It was really amazing and everything, but I was not Tarantino, you know? So it’s the last semester and Tilda Swinton is supposed to teach a seminar. I really wanted to attend it. It would be the cherry on top of the cake. Then she postponed it once, then twice. The third time, I’m on the tube and there’s a woman in front of me with a newspaper that says that Tilda’s super mentor, Derek Jarman, had passed away. It’s the very Monday morning that her seminar is set to begin. And I thought, Oh shit. She’s not going to be there. But then she was there after all and it was a fantastic week. There were only five of us students and we all fell in love with her. And she fell in love with us. I’ve known her since.

PS: I can only imagine. How’d you make the transition into books?

DS: You have to find out what you're really good at. I had long discussions with this guru, an old guy who was a very diligent, very bright guy. I was really miserable, feeling directionless. He asked me why I wasn’t continuing with filmmaking. And I couldn't give him an answer. Then he said right into my face, “Probably it’s because you’re not good enough.” The message was one-hundred percent received. It was a relief; I'm not a bad person. This guy told me the truth, and I could accept it. And when you can do this, you can figure out what you actually want to do, what you’re actually good at. I started making books. I made one with another film director. And we visited Tilda at her hotel, bringing one to her as a present. As we’re knocking, I thought to myself, If I did another book focused on people in this business, it’d have to be her. And she opens the door, looks at the book and says, “Oh, I would like to have a book like this on me.”

PS: These situations seem unreal.

DS: I spent five years on her book, which was an enormous success. It included stills from all her films and launched it in different cities. Fantastic shit.

PS: And now you’ve just released this soon-to-be iconic CDG book.

DS: I've learned to be patient; things can take you years. This book with Adrian and Remo took two years and I didn’t even know if it was going to be approved! Follow your dreams as much as you can. It's not so important which dream it is exactly. If I see a step in front of me, I try to take each chance I get. This is what I wish for everybody, in whatever situation you find yourself, start to do something with nothing. This book started with just a simple idea. You can not find anything like this on the Internet, this compilation, this narrative. It’s something we had to bring together with enormous work. And here we are. I think in our digital, splattered times sometimes you have to make something which is real. That you can sit with and focus on in silence and really take time alone with it.