I Would Love You If You Looked Like This:
The show opened at Maximillian William and I feel like we need to acknowledge that it’s virtual even for you because London went back into lockdown the same day. You made the paintings in quarantine, right?
Yeah, they were all made this year. The show that you curated in New York was March, early March?
Mid-March.
They were made entirely in quarantine, in my house. A lot of the research I did for them, finding reference photos, was done online. So, it wasn’t based on couches I was seeing “in the wild."
You weren’t couch shopping?
I wasn’t going to furniture stores, although I did try taking photos of couches in my own house, but they weren’t the right style, or the photos weren’t good enough. You need really good reference photos to paint something if you want to get details in it.
Left — Barcode Couch, 2020, Acrylic on Canvas, 10.27 x 48.07 x 1.57 in
Right — Ear Plug Couch, 2020, Acrylic on Canvas, 11.18 x 48.03 x 1.49 in
The couches in the paintings are mostly drawn from the 50s-70s. Furniture then was a big investment and a statement of personal taste and status. Why that era? What goes in to how you choose which couch to paint?
I’ve got written down what style or time period each couch is from and I realized maybe half are vintage and half are contemporary, and I basically skipped the 80s through 2010, just a whole 30-year block of time. Based on the style of the couches I wanted a variety of patterns. The yellow one is the most obviously ‘retro’ because it’s yellow and striped and I don’t know if they really make couches like that anymore. The green one, the yellow one, the blue one and the bamboo one are all older and the other ones are more recent. Maybe the orange one also looks like it’s older too.
That one could be –
It could be either. That one’s contemporary it just looks like a weird style. But one of the main things that narrowed it down was the literal shape of the couch, because I was trying to fit them into the canvas shape. I tried doing one with rolled arms, which is basically when the arms are lower, and they’re curved outside. It works best when the sides of the couch are boxy to match with the canvas. So that was a formal decision of what I wanted them to look or feel like. I don’t know about your childhood home, probably it was the same as mine- the couches I grew up with were very comfortable but very bulky, very puffy, frilly.
Lacy.
Not necessarily lacy, but we had a floral one, I loved it. I don’t think people would pick couches like that now; a little gaudier. I wanted there to be space between the bottom of the couch and the floor for the shadow. It works better for the paintings for them to be a boxier, narrow style than something puffy.
We spoke earlier about how many millennials have a different relationship to furniture—it’s either expendable or in a shared space and not even really ours.
My house has 6 couches. And they’re all... I don’t know where they came from. They’re just kind of there and it’s impossible to move them.
Installation view, I Would Love You If You Looked Like This:, Maximillian William, London, 5 November 2020 - 9 January 2021
The dominant trend in interior design is the “millennial aesthetic”. White walls, gray couch, too many plants. Are these paintings a rebellion against that?
I don’t think of them as being rebellious, they don’t feel like rebellious painting to me. But you’re right, the backgrounds don’t match up with that aesthetic, which can be so blank. I tried to specifically have the couch fill up as much of the canvas as possible and not leave room for anything. I think that aesthetic is about having open space, it’s more about potential—or millennials have this focus on being productive, so the spaces are open for that. I don’t know, I have way too much stuff to have that look for my apartment and everything I buy is off Craigslist.
I think it prioritizes open space because there’s so little of it to begin with.
Yeah, everything’s compact or folds up.
Small, neutral, and that goes back to the paintings being grandiose selections, especially the bamboo one. The paintings are eclectic and it goes totally against what couches are now. They’re either ignored or purposefully unnoticeable.
Yeah, it was nice to actually look at furniture. I never look at furniture because I’m always looking for what is available and cheap. These are all couches that I would never actually buy, but I get to make a decision about what I want to look at instead of the furniture that I actually own, which is based on convenience and availability. It’s nice to actually pick out furniture.
A part of the magnetism of the couch paintings is their unique shape. They have a sense of neat, formal solution. Form and content are merged. Is the canvas long because the couch is long, or is the couch long because the canvas is long?
The couch is long because the canvas is long. The original pink couch painting was that long because it was a text painting before it was a couch painting. And it was a really bad text painting that I just needed to get rid of, and it was just sitting in my studio for years and I thought -- I have to do something with this or throw it away. The couch was a solution to that problem. Haha. Worked out great!
Before these, there was another painting that was text above a couch. A captioned image, if you will.
Oh yeah yeah, that’s how I got the name for this show too. That was originally a sketch that I did in a manically depressed post break-up state. That’s a personal story, but that led to the original combo of the title and the couch where it was a really gross couch mixed with words and I was thinking “She would love me if I looked like a couch," but not a person. I also listen to this dating show. And they have something they say on the show—that you’re competing with someone’s couch when you’re starting to date, because, “I could go on this first date, or I could stay home on my couch and watch Netflix,” which one is more appealing in the moment? Maybe staying home is the better option sometimes.
The paintings are certainly surreal. There’s so much ambiguity to how they could be interpreted. Either room for everyone or a sad distance. To me the art history lodestar here is Magritte. Are the surrealists important to you? What are some influences?
I: I like the surrealists. They’re cool. Magritte’s a cool guy. I don’t think he’s necessarily an influence, but I have some other people that I like a lot. Maybe more of a contemporary surrealist—Seth Alverson, who is a painter that I met in Houston. He’s probably my favorite painter.
Left — Bamboo Bench, 2020, Acrylic on Canvas, 11.18 x 48.03 x 1.57 in
Right — Sawtooth Couch, 2020, Acrylic on Canvas, 11.22 x 47.99 x 1.57 in
He paints the fleshy hands and feet.
He paints a lot of weird, dark—in the past he’d done some amputated limbs which is a mental thing. I think about that too sometimes when I get anxious. I kind of imagine cutting off my hand or something. But that’s just another story for my therapist. I relate to him; he paints really great depressive imagery that’s kind of surreal, and I also love the way that he’ll single out a thing and just paint that one thing with a bullseye composition where it’s something gross in the middle. I was specifically looking at his backgrounds, because I don’t necessarily want the couches to be in any specific space. They’re ambiguously inside, outside, it’s not really clear, it’s more of a mood than a place. I do love his work. And the other guy is Domenico Gnoli, who does, the thing that I like that he does is really close up details. Again, he’ll focus on one thing like a button on someone’s shirt or someone’s hair and the way it curls and look really specifically at one detail. Those are my two favorite people that I’m looking at now.
The common denominator of focusing on one object.
And they’re surrealists, but they’re not like the typical Dali and Magritte.
What is Houston’s art scene like?
The art scene here is good, although I haven’t gone out in the last 7 months. I’ve been to the Menil and they have a nice park. One of the main things that I’m enjoying now is going to sculpture parks and that’s always been the case. Shout-out to Moonmist which is just in this guy’s backyard in Houston. Sweet Pass Sculpture Park in Dallas, The Nasher obviously, and Laguna Gloria is great.