Brandon - Savior Complex

Maybe it’s slowthai’s signature grin that makes him so charming and relatable. Perhaps it’s his Charlie Chaplin-esque whimsicality that makes him the ideal conduit for communicating our collective anxiety and anger in a format that feels both fresh and easy. Or maybe it’s the music itself—at once lo-fi, aggressive, and no-filter, Ty’s songs and visuals are manufactured through his lens of new masculinity. This viewpoint thrives off Ty's ability to communicate emotion without regret, and process trauma with no shame. No matter who you are or where you're from, it’s likely that you can relate to what slowthai is putting out. Especially right now, aren’t we all trying to just feel okay amidst the endless turmoil? 

Ty joins our Zoom call from a basement studio in his mom’s rural flat, where he lives permanently. It seemed like a no-brainer to link him with Tyler, the Creator, another unfiltered cultural curator who constantly challenges boundaries, particularly when it comes to notions of Black masculinity. 

Below, Tyler and Ty talk about feeling okay in 2020, Bono and doing things your own way.

Left — Jacket by CAV EMPT, hoodie by LEVI'S SKATEBOARD

Right — Jacket by SLAM JAM (UN)CORPORATE UNIFORMS, hat by CP COMPANY

Tyler, the Creator—I’m a piece of shit, I owe you a verse, and yes.

slowthai—Yeah, yeah you are a motherfucker. Are you engaged?

TC—Me? No, what the fuck?

ST—What is this? How come you wear your ring on your ring finger?

TC—Because some idiot made a fucking rule saying, ‘Hey, if you put anything that’s gold, silver, whatever, on this specific finger it means you’re married.’ Everyone, for some reason, followed that fucking rule and it’s dumb as fuck. I got a nice ring and I wanted it on this specific finger.

ST—Propose to me, man, come on.

TC—You fucking sicko, where you at?

ST—I’m at the yard, man, I’m just in the studio.

TC—You in London?

ST—No, Frankton. When are we making something?

TC—I want to come to London and lock in for two or three days. We can make whatever, it could be music, it could be a sex tape, it could be...

ST—You got to lube me up, man.

TC—Whoa, whoa, whoa, pause.

ST—No, real men don’t say pause, man. You know what I’m saying? I ain’t trying to pause, I’m comfortable in my sexuality.

TC—I’ll pause everything.

ST—Wow, why?

TC—How do you switch this camera? This is where I’m at right now.

ST—Where’s that?

TC—Northwest Washington.

ST—Why are you there?

TC—No reason, I just didn’t want to be in LA so I come here when I want to see trees and ducks and shit, it’s really pretty.

ST—You’re going to pull a ‘Little Pimp,’ innit?

TC—Dude that’s cap, I didn’t even really watch the video. I didn’t watch the video in full because I was just cringing so hard. This year’s kind of wild because every hypothetical you could think of is very possible.

ST—Yeah, the way the world is happening around you.

TC—Really funny. Of course, this year sucks but I find humor in it that every hypothetical you could think of is very possible.

ST—I can’t believe none of it, everything that keeps happening, I’m like, 'Is this even a reality we are living in?' I’m feeling like this is some bullshit. It’s good, it’s like watching a sitcom.

TC—Yeah, it’s like a really, really detailed comedy. The writers just keep on trying to up last season, it’s interesting.

ST—What’s next though?

TC—In the world or for me?

ST—The world, we’ll get to you in a sec but your prediction is what I want.

TC—I have no idea! That’s why I came to Washington to just look at ducks and trees and not really be on my phone or just talk about other stuff for the next two days because it’s a lot. I feel like it’s weird. I think people could read that and be like, ‘privilege,’ and make someone feel guilty. Sometimes I think about like if this was 1974 or something, whatever’s going on in a town in Montana and I live in LA, I wouldn’t really know about it because I’m focused on what’s going on in my city. Not even really my state but just my city. Now, because of the internet, we know everything that’s going on in Montana, New York, fucking India, every fucking place. It’s so much information being fed to us. Not that it’s a bad thing, you should be aware, but it being so much and you’re supposed to care about everything and people will try to make you feel guilty about not doing enough, blah, blah, blah, blah. I’m like, 'Man, fuck this, I’m going to go get a canoe for a few days, listen to some music and not worry about shit.' That shit stresses you and it ages you and you’ll be gray and end up getting fucking cancer just thinking about everything. I’m off it.

Left — Trousers by DRIES VAN NOTEN, shoes by ROA

Right — Vest by STONE ISLAND SHADOW PROJECT, trousers and rib socks by NEIGHBOURHOOD, hat by CRAIG GREEN, boots by MONCLER

ST—The fucking woods is good, man. That’s what fucked this world. Earlier I’d done an interview and it was this lady from Austria and she was interviewing and there was a terrorist attack. I didn’t hear about none of that, there was like four people who got shot and died or whatever. In England it’s just posts about fucking Donald Trump and Biden or whatever, I’m like, 'How the fuck did I miss anything else going on? How is my focus, and I’m not even in America, Joe Biden and fucking Donald Trump?' I was like, 'I want Little Pimp.'

TC—Yeah, it’s the weirdest thing. Even that, your time and day is consumed with what’s going on over here, which everything has a ripple effect and that will affect everything else in the world. Maybe you just want to go get a cup of coffee next door. You probably just want to drink your coffee, just for a day but then you try to do that and people will make you feel guilty. Some people aren’t privileged [enough] to do that and some people don’t have that choice. It’s like bro, n---- I just want cream and sugar, and to drink my coffee for an hour.

ST—Even so, if you wasn’t privileged and you didn’t have the privilege, and then you work to get the privilege, and then you enjoy the fruits of your labor, how the fuck can you not enjoy it? Why should you feel guilty for enjoying something you worked to achieve anyway?

TC—Again, I don’t come from money or things like that, now that I’m able to experience certain things, sometimes... that’s the weirdest thing, to get on the other side and people are like, 'No, fuck that.' It’s such a weird thing, that’s a whole different conversation and I don’t even know if I’m able to articulate it without sounding like a dick. I don’t think I’m there yet where I’m able to articulate that in the right way, maybe in a few years. I think in two years I’ll be able to articulate these thoughts in the right tone with the right vocabulary.

ST—You can’t ever win, you won’t ever win, no matter what. You can support every problem or you can be there.

TC—If money is a thing now with class and things, if everyone had the same amount of money, we would find something to hate each other on or have a competition with who has the biggest thumbs. Well if you have the smallest thumbs, we treat you like this. It never wins and we do that with skin tone now and we do it with height. We’ll never win as a species. With that said, for the time being, for the next three days, I’ll be looking at ducks and water.

ST—That’s what I’m trying. I’m trying to see something like that but I’m in the middle of a lockdown. I’m going to be in this fucking city—

TC—I’m so sorry that I, again, one of the darkest times of my life personally, from Tyler’s brain—my experience was in April during quarantine, when we were for real locked down, didn’t go out, didn’t see anyone. I live in a very populated area so I didn’t get to see people walking around and stuff. I went four days without seeing people until I went to grab a bite to eat. It was, I fucking hated it, I was losing my mind. I don’t like to sit on the couch and watch Netflix, I like being outside and I like when the sun is right here. I fucking hated it so I’m sorry that you have to be on lockdown again.

ST—I’m actually quite, I’m thriving right now. Even though it’s bullshit, life hasn’t stopped for me. I’ll still be going kickboxing and shit, still doing all that. I’m going to stay in but I’m not staying in, I’m going out, man. I’ve got my cross—I’ve got a motocross bike so I’m riding rather than fucking sitting in my house. If I feel, I’ll go to the locker, hit the bag and I’m fucking gone. I’m there all day, come back, have a bath, chill the fuck out and then do the same thing tomorrow.

TC—You motocross?

ST—Yeah, yeah.

TC—I saw a video of you but I didn’t know you, for real, was into it like that.

ST—I want a deal, that’s why I’m getting ready man. I’m trying to get ready for a fight, that’s what I want to do. I want to have this kickboxing shit on lock and I’m trying to smash something for now, man.

TC—Wow you kickbox, that’s fire.

ST—That’s what I’m saying. Motocross, that and football, and then just music at the moment.

TC—How long have you been kickboxing for?

ST—I’d done it when I was younger but then I started about two months ago now. I’m getting good, I’m getting my question mark kick. I’m getting my tornado kick, then I’ll worry about the roundabout.

TC—You would probably fuck me up.

ST—Yeah I would fuck you up.

TC—You would. I’m definitely faster than you.

ST—No man, we’ve got to race. I see you racing everybody and I’m like, 'No, this guy is not quick.' I’ll Usain Bolt your ass.

TC—Listen, we could set it up, we could put one of our houses on it.

ST—I’m not getting one. I’m still trying to get a house. I’ll bet you the house I’m buying and then we can run.

TC—We can put anything on it.

ST—What do you want? I’ll tell you what...

TC—I’m dusting your shit.

ST—I’ll tell you what, listen to this, I will bet you if I win, yeah, you have to do everything I ask for a year. For a year, you’ve got to do it. If I ask you to, if you got to bungee jump off the fucking Empire State, we’ll make it happen. If it’s fucking, I don’t know, some dumb shit, it’s got to happen. You state your claim, I’ll do it.

TC—You’ll be the sixth person that’s like, I’ll beat you, and then it’s like, 'Okay,' and then I’ll race you and you lose and then n----s is looking like, 'Uhhh...' It always happens like this. I think it’s cute.

ST—I’ll tell you what, I’m a cheap motherfucker but listen to this, I’ll win and you’re my bitch for a year.

TC—I think you want to date me.

ST—What?

TC—I think that’s what that is, I think you just want to date me. We can talk about that later but...

ST—I’m engaged, dummy, I’m actually engaged. I’m engaged.

TC—What’s his name?

ST—You twat. I’ve got a Katarina, man, she’s from Russia. She’s upstairs, she’s chilling.

TC—That’s nice.

ST—Yeah.

TC—It’s going to be weird when you tell her that I beat you with these legs, bro. Pause.

ST—Blah, blah, blah, it’s not a possibility. Hey, listen, name a place, name a date and we’ll do this.

TC—I got a house where I store, I got a bunch of dirt bikes and ATVs and shit, four-wheelers, next time you come to LA, you should definitely come by and see what it’s about.

ST—What, you got land?

TC—Yeah.

ST—Let’s go, brother, I’m ready. I’m ready.

TC—I can’t figure the dirt bike shit out because that shit is heavy but I love the four-wheeler. I love the ATV. I love that shit.

ST—I bought my first dirt bike. What have you got?

TC—I honestly don’t fucking know. I went in there and I was like, 'I like this, I like this, give me this.'

ST—A Banshee.

TC—It’s something, one of them is a Yamaha I think. I got a Suzuki. I couldn’t, if someone had a gun to my head right now and said tell me what you have, it’s a dub, I’m dead.

ST—When are you coming here then?

TC—I don’t know. I wanted to come out there and be a little hoe because I got some things out there, you feel me. They were like, they’re going on another lockdown. I’m like you fucking lying and then there you have it, the guy’s on another lockdown.

ST—It’s only a month, yeah, it’s a month, man. Come tomorrow, a month.

TC—A fucking month. Who knows, I hope we don’t go on another one out here in America, I really hope we don’t.

ST—If you get Biden you’ll go on lockdown, if you get Donald Trump it’s a free for all motherfucker, you’re running free.

TC—Yeah, I don’t... I haven’t been paying as much attention in the last few days as people make me think I should have. Hopefully that’s not true if Biden wins that we’re on another lockdown. I don’t know.

ST—I don’t know, man.

Left — Jacket by MONCLER, trousers by DRIES VAN NOTEN, balaclava by STONE ISLAND, chain SLOWTHAI'S OWN

TC—That’s pretty selfish of me but what’s wrong with being selfish?

ST—I think it’s fair, man, I’m fucking fed up with this shit. This guy could have, this dickhead could have done it, he could have done a lockdown a month ago and then we’d be in the position where it would be... because it’s going to be the same thing. At the end of this one, he’s going be like, 'Oh, well...' It don’t make sense, he’s locked everything down except for schools, schools and universities are still open. It don’t make no sense because in the end children are the ones that contract, they’ll pass that on as quick if their parents let them go to school. The next kid takes it back and then we’re just back again.

TC—It doesn’t make sense to me either. If you shut it down, okay you curve it a bit but then... I know exactly what you’re implying. I fully agree. It’s crap.

ST—It’s a double recession. After this, we’re basically in a recession without them making it known, and we’ve gone into the second recession and it’s coming up to the third one, which will be like a depression rather than a recession. We’re going to be, the country is already bankrupt but it’s going to be fucked. Bruv, did you see this guy, an English politician went on TV and said if you are a creative, you should look at another job. You should be looking at finding another avenue of employment because they can’t support anybody who’s working in the arts or something. I don’t know.

TC—I saw that and I thought it was interesting. I saw people angry but I also understood the sentiment. I think I understood what he meant, which just forecasting, he’s basically saying, 'Look, I don’t know.' What I took it as is he don’t know what the fuck is about to happen. So you all better figure it out before it’s too hard to figure it out. I think that’s what he was saying. Now, do I agree? I don’t know, whoopty whoop, but I could see why both sides were like, 'What the fuck!? How dare he say some shit like that?!'

ST—I agree with you, fuck this.

TC—It’s super real with the next few months because no one knows what the fuck’s going on, so he’s like, 'You all n----s better get prepared if you can before the preparing is long gone.' I was like, 'Fuck, that is terrifying.'

ST—It’s logical, bro, everybody ought to. It’s bullshit, everything. You can’t even live in normality, I’m just trying to do something normal without fucking...

TC—Out there, do you live in the city where it’s super dense, or is it more on the outskirts?

ST—It’s about two hours from London. It’s in between Birmingham and London. It’s fucking, there’s nothing really here, man. Even, I don’t know, Uber Eats is an example of it. You’re getting a kebab. You can’t come back, that’s it, you ain’t getting nothing, you ain’t getting no truffle fries, let’s put it that way.

TC—You’re sort of in the middle of no man’s land.

ST—No man’s land and everybody here is fucking dumb, man. They don’t understand, they just don’t get it. It’s like whatever is relevant now is like ten years behind here. Obviously, there are kids who are into everything but it’s not most people.

TC—As an overall that place experienced latency, it’s late with... wow.

ST—I don’t know. Obviously, there’s a vibe but not much of it. The only thing here is pubs and kebab shops.

TC—Oh shit, I see. England’s a really interesting place, man. It’s a place that I’m still learning more and more about, about the outskirts, about the, what do you call it, the zones?

ST—No it’s like home, it’s like a state, like Midlands, East Midlands, the North, it’s split into sections but not like zones. I can’t even think what they’re called, it’s just Midlands. I’m in the East Midlands.

TC—The more out you go, or, I don’t know, someone was explaining it to me. I think they was explaining it to me because they take the train, though.

ST—Oh no, you’re talking about in London there’s zones. There’s Zone 1, Zone 2, it’s split into Central London... it’s obviously how much it cost to travel to each zone. You can either get the one thing for your zone, but that’s London. Even there they haven’t got—London is dry, bro, it’s good because there’s a lot more stuff. They’re just, I don’t know.

TC—Is there anywhere you want to live? Your dream spot of relocating?

ST—I don’t know, I think I want to live in the countryside just because I can do what the fuck I want. I feel like, recently I felt like I want to spend some time in Paris but I don’t know if that’s because, just the fucking, the romance of that. I don’t know, there’s just something about it. I like LA but at the same time, everything seems a bit superficial in some places. I don’t know, man, I kind of feel like I’m going to float around and see. I didn’t spend enough time anywhere to make a decision about where I want to be.

TC—It’s always interesting when people say LA is very superficial or very fake or whatever. I’m always curious on the LA people see. I was born and raised there so I guess I move very differently than people who aren’t from there. From the restaurants I go to and the streets I take and the people I frequent, I never got to the place of feeling like that. I think a lot of the people that people meet are also from out of town so it’s certain spots. Like, 'This is the spot to go to but I’m actually from New York,' but someone that’s from New York told me to come here because they didn’t know where else to go because they didn’t grow up here. I think that’s what it might be.

ST—I’m 100% with that because I think everyone who I’ve come into contact with, the people that I fuck with heavy over there is Kevin, KB, people that are from the hood, and they’re chill. When you spend a lot of time with people who they aren’t from there and they do what’s exciting or they go to Chateau or do da da da da. It seems like a lot of the time I spend rolling to all these places and I’m like, 'Bro, I’m not even that interested.'

TC—That’s the thing, I know people who go to the Chateau, I think that hotel’s fucking trash and ugly, like why do you want to hang out there? I think it’s the idea of going there because of, 'Oh they did this in 1978 in this room and I go here to smoke my cigarette.' Then, at certain restaurants, they go to where they know paparazzi will be. I grew up in Hawthorn and Englewood so I move differently, I know LA. I know what colors not to wear. I grew up around that so I’m not going to the fucking Chateau, I’m not going to Cha Cha Matcha, what the fuck? I’m not going to St. Alfred’s, I don’t even fucking drink coffee but I know of these spots, I know the type of people that go there. I’m well versed in everything but when people that’s not from there tell me LA sucks, I’m like, 'Why?' Because these places and these people.

ST—I don’t know, when I was doing things and I was on my own, shit, I was rolling around doing my own thing. I was like, 'This is a vibe.' Then I started linking up, I don’t know. I go to them places and they seem pretentious and I’m like, 'This is bad.'

Left — T-shirt by WTAPS, cardigan by COMME DES GARÇONS, shirt and trousers by ARIES, socks by NEIGHBOURHOOD, boots by MONCLER

Right — T-shirt by WTAPS, cardigan by COMME DES GARÇONS, shirt and chain SLOWTHAI'S OWN

TC—I’m mad. I’m going to take you around. Three weeks ago, right before it got cold in LA, which cold for us is like 67 degrees, which is probably warm for you guys, but being from LA, that’s freezing. I took this girl to a beach early in the morning and she was like, 'I’ve never been here blah, blah, blah.' I’m like, 'What beach do you go to?' She’s like, 'They always tell me to go to Malibu or Venice,' and I’m like, 'No, you don’t... that’s not, no.' She was shocked that she’s never been to this particular beach. That made me think about when people aren’t from here, it’s really, it’s places they really don’t know exist because the people showing them go to Google to look them up. I got to start being more aware of that and change that for all my friends who aren’t from there to show them what Los Angeles is really like.

ST—That’s the thing, where is that? I’m one of them people, I don’t mind going to the hood. I’m not saying it’s the right thing but I feel like whenever you go somewhere the best place to gauge a vibe is when you go to where people are really from there, where there’s not mad money circulating and everyone is doing their thing. Even when you go there, everyone’s like no you can’t go here and I’m like, 'How are you going to see it for real if I’m just going to the fucking popular spot?' I want to go to the greasy nasty shit that’s there.

TC—I’m going to take you to the food spots and the areas. Don’t get me wrong, there’s some spots that no, we shouldn’t go there n----. You look that shit up on Google.

ST—I know.

TC—I’m going to take you around because it’s different, it’s the shit that—everyone cares about different things so you might be with people who like the idea of being seen and stuff. Like, man, I’m in LA and I’m so low key, paparazzi won’t be on me like that because I know how to move and I don’t like going in the areas where they are. I might eat here and there but it’s a whole different world. I wonder if you spent two days with us, with me and my friends, if that would change your perception on the idea of Los Angeles. You might end up loving it, like, 'Oh, I want to be here because I know where and where not to go.'

ST—Yeah, I’m down, baby. When I come out there we’ll do something, man, because I’m sick of going—let’s see, either I’m in the studio or I’m going somewhere around The Chateau in West Hollywood. This is not it. Most of the time I end up taking shrooms and chilling in the fucking AirBnB. I’m like, 'Can we just set up a studio in here and not leave?'

TC—I’ll take you to the ice cream spots, the burger spots, we got to go biking. We ain’t going to be at no fucking Delilah, we ain’t going to be at no fucking—none of that. I’m going to show you the good spots. I’ll show you my spots.

ST—You’re native to there, bro, that’s better than... I don’t know. Anyway, it sounds like I’m just slacking it off but at the same time, I do like it there but I don’t like doing the same shit.

TC—I was like that about Miami, I used to hate Miami because everyone’s like, 'Go here, go to the strip club.' I don’t want to see girls shaking their ass n----. Then go here and go... it’s like, bro. Then the one time I, oh the sun is beaming, I love that. Yes, n----, I love sunlight so much, goddamn bitch, yes. I went to Miami and I was like, 'Let me do it my way.' Rented a nice house right off the water, we had a cook who made us french toast whenever we wanted and shit, and pastries and we had Uno cards set up. We were just chilling. Then I wanted to test drive this car so I had this car for the weekend and I test drove it because I ended up buying it. It wasn’t some, 'Oh I’m in Miami' rapper shit, I literally test drove it. We took the car to the Everglades to play with alligators and feed birds. Then we went to go eat sushi and then we went jet skiing. We went jet skiing for hours and we were playing with dolphins and getting fucked up by the big waves from the boats. It was, there was more stuff that happened but it was so my speed. It was like my type of thing. I fell in love with Miami, I fell in love with the sunset over the bridge that connects to the other sections. I had to do it in my way and not the way people were telling me. Which was, 'Go to the strip club, go over here,' they be doing it but that’s not my speed.

ST—We like doing normal things, where the fuck am I going to do that? I don’t know.

TC—Yeah, the normal shit. We was in Miami looking at vintage cars and riding the bikes through little Haiti, seeing the, it’s such a different architecture and just how set up differently it is from LA. I was in love with it and you never see that because everybody’s like go to the club. Go to South Beach.

ST—I went to a club, when I went to Miami I went to a club there and it was fucking weird. I didn’t have ID and I didn’t want to go in, I forgot my ID but it was kind of on purpose. Then I went in with the car and I was like, 'Yeah,' then when we go there I was like, 'Aw I forgot my ID.' It’s an hour drive or something, I was like, 'I’ll just go back, I’m all right.' They were like, 'No, I’ll speak to the guy, come in.' I went in there and there was this big shark on the wall and every time a song was playing, like EDM, the song would go and this foam would come out of the shark's mouth. I’m looking how to end this, bro, I want to go.

TC—I don’t party, I’ve never liked to party, I’ve never clubbed, I’ve never... I don’t even drink so that side of the world wasn’t lucrative, it wasn’t interesting to me. When I did it my way, man I fell in love with that fucking city. I love Miami now and that sunlight, I love when that fucking sun just beaming just right fucking here.

ST—It’s hot, Miami’s hot man.

TC—I love it.

ST—I like it. I like being in the sun but it gets to a point where I’m fried.

TC—I need it, n----, give me some shorts.

ST—I get to the point where I’m like, 'Where the shade? I need to fucking cool off.'

TC—Put my fucking feet in some shoes, untied with no socks because my feet don’t sweat, throw my little hat on, it’s a wrap.

ST—I’ll come out there as soon as this shit’s all over. I might. I’m done with being here.

TC—It’s sick, though, but I feel you, there’s spots that I still don’t really like because it’s not my speed. I fully understand when it’s like, 'Nah, that’s not for me.'

ST—Where’s the worst place you’ve been? Anywhere you’ve ever been you hate it the most.

TC—My least favorite place, oh, Luxembourg. It’s near Germany. I mean that place, nope, that place fucking sucks. I’ll say it, that place dick is soft bro.

ST—You didn’t like it?

TC—No, nope, nope, nope and I don’t... I went to Brazil once but not Rio. I think it was São Paulo, I didn’t enjoy it there but that was so long ago, that was in 2011. I probably would have a different experience if I went now. I don’t even think it’s fair to currently judge that because it’ll probably be a whole different, I have a whole different set of eyes now than I did when I was twenty.

ST—I suppose it changes, innit, man? That’s the thing, that’s why I can’t, off a first impression, I can’t make my decision because I’ll start being like, 'I hate it,' then I go back. Like France. I went there three times and I was like, 'I can’t fucking stand this place.' Then recently I went to Valence, which is two hours away from Marseilles, it was out in the hood. They were riding motocross, wheeling all around the street doing all kind of fucked shit. All the houses are boarded up, it’s all derelict. They’re all out vibing in the street doing barbecues and shit. They didn’t speak one word of English, I don’t speak French and I just got them, they got me and we were on a vibe.

TC—It’s energy, it’s definitely... you all don’t even know the language but it’s an energy, that shit we can’t see, that allowed you to just enjoy yourself.

ST—We didn’t need to talk, fucking—that’s the best vibe though, man. That’s how you know when you’re vibing with someone, you could be there for hours and not necessarily have to say too much but there’s still a vibe.

TC—Language is so—I was speaking to a friend about words about a week ago, when I listen to music I listen to the music first, the melody. Does that feel good? If not, I don’t give a fuck how good the lyrics are. Miracles, spiritual shit, I don’t care how deep they are. If it doesn’t sound good it’s not for me. That’s not some crazy shit, 90% of the world feels like that probably. Then I was thinking about, I feel like words are just reference points. It’s to really sing along in a more detailed way. When we sing our 'A-B-C-D-E,' we’re not really remembering the letters, it’s the melody. You know what I mean? Words are secondary. 'Twinkle Twinkle Little Star,' we’re remembering the melody. That’s why a fucking two-year-old is able to.

TC—Yeah, it’s crazy that sometimes we put so much emphasis on words and what’s said rather than that energy and the feeling of it. I think that’s why we like Playboi, not saying just me and you but as a whole, why we like Playboi Carti. The man’s not even really speaking fucking English but the energy.

ST—It’s a vibe dog.

TC—It’s such an energy and there’s so much nuance to it that we’re attracted to that rather than the actual words. I don’t give a fuck, I don’t need this n---- to read me what Carl Sagan wrote, I’m just feeling it. I think being aware of that is so important to a lot of people. Then you get into speaking the language and the language isn’t just words. I remember Offset put an album out and someone was like, 'That shit is trash!' I was like, 'But it wasn’t made for you.' Take it away objectively or whatever the fuck but man, it’s some kid that’s thirteen that grew up in Atlanta who had an older brother that had a specific Camaro. He loves that fucking album because the language is speaking to him to the end result of where he grew up, his experiences, the people he knows, the slang, the language, the food, all of that. That album is probably godlike to him. To the person who’s saying it’s trash, bro, you grew in Montana.

ST—They don’t understand.

TC—You don’t understand the language and it’s not just the words. You don’t understand the energy and the tone, the perspective that that comes from.

ST—That’s what I think with the hood thing because you could come from Hungary, or however you pronounce it, and if you’re from the hood, it’s the same, it’s still speaking to you. You know what I’m saying even if you don’t understand the language, it’s embedded in the fucking vibe.

TC—It’s embedded in the hums, it’s embedded in the vocal phrasing and the choice of drums, and the way that the pants are worn. It’s not necessarily exactly what kind of pants or how they’re worn, but it’s like, 'Oh, you made that choice because this happened.'

ST—It’s the similarity in some aspects, yeah.

TC—It’s so interesting and I feel like that’s why we gravitate to what we gravitate to. Sometimes it’s unexplainable because it’s that invisible language, it’s that energy, it’s that aura, it’s that thing that we as humans, we’re not advanced enough to comprehend.

Left — Cardigan by WACKO MARIA, t-shirt by SLAM JAM X BRAIN DEAD, necklace by 1017 ALYX 9SM, shorts by NIKE, socks by NEIGHBOURHOOD, shoes by NIKE DUNK HIGH X SLAM JAM

Right — Coat by WACKO MARIA

ST—You can’t explain it, it just is what it is. That’s what I think is fucking, it’s the language, isn’t it? It’s music in itself, melody or whatever is its own fucking, it’s what connects so many people. That’s why there’s so many people all across the world that vibe with this one fucking thing and we don’t know it.

TC—Do you watch television at all?

ST—Yeah I do. I don’t really watch it, it’s kind of background noise.

TC—I recently got into a few shows. I was never a TV watcher much, my friends are, so whenever they tell me to watch something they think I’ll like, I try to check it out. Most of that time is spent listening to music or being outside. It’s a few shows I’ve been watching the past month that I’m fucking super in love with. I was just curious if you watched any.

ST—I’ve seen you tweet, it wasn’t your tweet, no you commented, I’ve seen something posted about We Are Who We Are...

TC—Yeah, that show.

ST—I was trying to get it because we don’t have HBO and shit, I just love Kudi, he’s the god.

TC—Check it out, I really, really, really like that show. It’s very dreamlike and something I like about it is how they tell you about the characters. Instead of the kid saying, 'I like the color orange,' and you know that he likes the color orange, they’ll put an orange flag somewhere and you’ll watch him and his eyes, how he reacts to it and you’ll watch him throughout the day. You end up knowing he likes orange and you watch how they act when you follow them all day and you learn about them like that. Then, they’re all together and you see how they react and bounce off of each other. I thought that was really interesting and I don’t know. It’s a really cool and interesting show, it’s such a world. I like when shows aren’t trying to be good or bad, it’s just an idea that got executed and it is what it is, it’s its own thing.

ST—Yeah, it’s like its own universe in a way. That’s why I read fucking comics and superhero shit because it’s its own fucking universe. Like Star Wars.

TC—I’ve never seen Star Wars.

ST—If I was going to say watch it, I’d say watch the original three.

TC—I’ve never watched Star Wars, I watched Harry Potter actually, the first one for the first time like two months ago.

ST—What did you think about that?

TC—It was cool. It was cool, I don’t know if I want to watch the other ones much.

ST—The last ones yeah, but I like villains man. I’ve got this thing where I fucking hate the good guy and I want the villain.

TC—Everyone loves villains. All of our countries were built on villains. We love villains.

ST—I love when the villain wins, the villain never wins. What about the one film, there needs to be a movie where the villain wins. The villain prevails, man.

TC—Have you ever seen The Boys?

ST—Yeah I did, that shit is funny.

TC—That show is fire.

ST—And at the end where it’s that the woman turns into him.

TC—Oh you like that, you a freak, you like that shit.

ST—Then the stranger is like, 'Fuck this, fuck this bitch. I am not taking this shit no more. You can’t get in my fucking head.' That shit is fire. That shit is fire.

TC—The Boys is really good. I like seeing the fucked up shit, yeah let’s see the dark side of it. I never liked superhero movies, I never liked The Hulk, Spiderman, Batman, I never really watched them. It’s just not my thing, so when my friend told me about The Boys and was like, you’ll like this perspective of this, it was fucking good. There’s so much nuance to it and a whole different outlook, it’s fire.

ST—Yeah it’s the perspective, and I spent hours fucking with that shit. Have you ever watched Submarine? It’s a different thing.

TC—Yeah, is Submarine, oh wait Submarine... or no, I’m thinking of Squid in a Well. No, Submarine?

ST—It’s written by Richard Ayoade who’s like a comedian, a dry, dry comedian. Check it out.

TC—I’ve definitely seen this fucking... yeah, yeah I’ve seen this movie. I watched this and I watched The Squid in the Well the same day, that’s why I got them mixed up.

ST—I don’t know, what’s The Squid in the Well?

TC—It’s another one of those dry indie movies.

ST—That shit’s my favorite shit, man because I like how fucking bland but at the same time, it’s the irony of life in a way. It’s bland and the soundtrack’s cool. Alex Turner is a G in that.

TC—I know that one. There’s this movie called Sing Street I think from 2016, that’s based in the UK, some kid in school that starts a band to get this girl. It’s kind of cheeky and I like that fucking movie, it’s very cute but it’s fucking fire. I don’t know if you will fuck with it but as soon as you said Submarine, the lead character kind of looks like him.

ST—You know what this film is based on? It’s based on U2.

TC—U2? The band with fucking Bono? Bono’s stupid ass?

ST—Bono, this is based on them, how they met on the island and their band at school because they started in school and shit.

TC—I did not know that. I hate that movie now. I fucking hate Bono. You know why I hate Bono? Fucking Apple decided to put his fucking album on my fucking phone without my fucking permission so fuck that n----.

ST—You can’t get rid of it, I couldn’t.

TC—I couldn’t delete it bro, fuck. Also, genius, genius marketing plan but also makes me hate that motherfucker. Go sing at another fucking fundraiser like save the Earth, save the Earth! Suck my dick, Bono.

Left — Sweater by ERL, trousers by CAV EMPT, socks by NEIGHBOURHOOD, shoes by NIKE DUNK HIGH X SLAM JAM

Right — T-shirt by WTAPS, cardigan by COMME DES GARÇONS, shirt and chain SLOWTHAI'S OWN

ST—They sung at the fundraiser, the first Live Aid, and they didn’t raise no money, and then along comes Freddie Mercury and fucked that up.

TC—Bono cool, he don’t mean no harm. I just wish they didn’t put that fucking stupidass dumbass album on my fucking phone without my fucking permission. That was probably fucking, that was probably Jimmy Iovine’s fucking idea.

ST—Quick get in there, U2 one of the biggest bands in history ever to do it, let’s give them... He’s actually, his son, they’ve got a band and they covered one of my songs. It wasn’t particularly executed that great but it was still the thought that counts, I thought this was fire.

TC—I’m going to look that up, that’s cool. One thing, I love when bands cover songs but it’s kind of shitty because I don’t want it perfect. I want the feeling and I like the lack of expertise a little bit because it gives it nuance. I’m kind of into that shit.

ST—I’m actually cool with it in a cringy way because we know when the guitar sounds, it’s like saying the song’s on a synth, the bass is a synth and they’re playing it on the guitar. I don’t know, I was fucking with it, but at the same time I was like, 'Man...'

TC—No, I think it’s because it’s your song so you have such a connection to it that no one else has. Someone else trying to channel, someone else doing your shit, you’re always going to feel like, 'Ugh.' There’s some kids that covered 'New Magic Wand' and it’s fucking horrible and it’s one of my favorite things ever. I never uploaded it, I was going to upload it on the year anniversary, it’s so fucking cool because it’s not good but it’s great. Sun City Girls, they do a cover of 'Me and Mrs. Jones,' it’s a classic soul song and the guy’s voice sounds like a fucking teapot when it’s too hot, he’s screeching and it’s gross. It’s one of my favorite covers of all time. If you get a chance, listen to Sun City Girls, 'Me and Mrs. Jones,' and then listen to the original and you’ll be like, 'These are not the same,' but that’s why it’s so good.

ST—I’ll fucking check it out, I’ll check it, man.

TC—[singing] 'Me and Mrs. Jones...'

ST—Do you feel like it’s been a year since both our albums came out?

TC—Man, it feels like... honestly time doesn’t exist to me anymore.

ST—I’m used to it and then when everything comes around, it don’t feel like it’s been...

TC—I don’t know if time feels shorter or longer. I’m at, because of the way the world is right now, I’m just existing. I’m fully just existing, I’m just alive. Every Wednesday feels... I don’t even, days don’t even fucking matter anymore, I’m just here. I just threw up in my mouth a little bit, oh my god.

ST—That’s that reflex.

TC—Yo!

ST—You need to chill out on all that shit.

TC—You are, pause, pause, pause.

ST—Fuck you man, you can’t pause me.

Left — Shirt by BRAIN DEAD, hat by STUSSY

TC—Everybody got they camera closed so I can’t see their fucking reaction but you all some fucking weirdos, I’ll tell you that right now.

BRADLEY BLEDSOE—I’m trying to let you guys have a one on one.

TC—Pause. I actually forgot there were other people here.

BB—Good.

TC—I don’t think I said anything crazy except fuck Bono.

ST—I was slewing inside this whole house.

TC—I gotta chill though, I feel like Bono will get me killed. Bono will get me chipped.

ST—I’m about to say something that I shouldn’t say but I’m going to say you’re getting the IRA mad, you know what I’m saying?

TC—Yeah, I don’t hate Bono but also fuck him for putting his album on my phone. I’m going to chill, he’ll get me clapped, that’s fire. That would be a South Park episode, Bono getting me clapped.

ST—Do you think he’s angry? Do you think he’s actually angry because he’s Irish? How tall is Bono? Does he have little man syndrome? That’s the question.

TC—That’s funny. How tall are you?

ST—I’m 5’11 I think.

TC—That’s sexy as fuck.

ST—How tall are you?

TC—Like 6’1.

ST—I would wrap you up man.

TC—What? Pause! See that’s the shit I been talking about, he keeps trying to fuck me, bro.

ST—Ah no, no.

TC—He keeps trying to fuck me on this interview.

ST—The whole nation’s running wild for you right now man.

TC—He going to wrap me up?

ST—Wrap you up, that’s what we say when we—

TC—No, nah, nah you trying to go crazy. Wow. I’m flattered.

ST—How tall is Bono? Bro, he is tiny. He’s 5’6”.

TC—Of course he is, he wears leather jackets. I’ve never seen a tall n---- in my life wear a leather jacket.

ST—I bet you’ve worn a leather jacket.

TC—No, no, no, no, I’ve never done the leather with the little strap, the neck strap that be flapping when you get excited and turn too fast.

ST—I see you in on your Harley Davidson riding through like, 'Yeah.'

TC—I fucking do not like motorcycles. They’re dangerous, not a fun dangerous. I mean I guess they’re fun. At least now, maybe when I’m 47 and maybe balding and going through a midlife crisis because the kids don’t care about me no more, I’ll buy a motorcycle.

ST—I’m going to buy one but I need to get this driving license, I’m trying to get a fucking road license.

TC—Can you drive a car?

ST—I can but I haven’t got a license.

TC—That’s what they all say.

ST—Let me get in your car, I’ll show you how to fucking drive.

TC—You know how to drive stick good?

ST—Listen, you need to pause, motherfucker, again.

TC—N---- I’m just asking if you know how to drive a stick.

ST—Now you’re trying to... I see how this is, you can’t lure me in like that.

TC—Bro I’m just asking if you know how to drive a stick, it’s not nothing weird.

ST—Oh you mean the weird car?

TC—Yeah, like stick.

ST—It’s the language barrier, I swear. I could drive one. I don’t drive automatic, I drive manual.

TC—So you drive stick?

ST—I ain’t saying that. I ain’t saying that to you. Entrapment, this is entrapment! Fucking, what car are you driving now?

TC—It depends on the day of the week.

ST—Like that, you’re going like that. What is the selection of cars you’re driving?

TC—I have a McLaren, I have a Rolls Royce, I have an E30 BMW, I have two Lancia Delta Evos, and I have another car on a cargo plane right now.

ST—What car is that?

TC—You’ll see.

ST—What car is your favorite car?

TC—What’s my favorite? I don’t know probably my E30, my little BMW, that shit, I know how to drive that thing. I know how to drive all of them well but I love that little fucking, little cute thing. It’s the cutest thing ever. If that car had a dick, I would suck it.

ST—They’re the best ones, you’re into Germans, innit?

TC—Huh?

ST—You’re into Germans, German whips.

TC—Oh. I love little—actually Lancia is Italian, the Beamer, and then the Rolls is English, McLaren’s English from Surrey, Surrey, England. I don’t like American cars at all.

ST—See, when I was young, my stepdad, he always had BMWs, man.

TC—Good cars, and the new one that’s coming is Italian.

ST—You’re a car man, I’m trying to do my driving but I can’t because of this fucking quarantine.

TC—That’s why you got to get the fuck out of there and come, bring your ass to the US, come to the cut, you come hang out and we could go to my little ranch and drive little ATVs and fucking have orgies.

ST—Pause, man, pause. I don’t even pause but I’m pausing this.

TC—Look, Ty, I need nudes, and send me more shit to get on, and hopefully I’ll hop on it.

Left — Jacket by SLAM JAM (UN)CORPORATE UNIFORMS, hat by CP COMPANY, chain SLOWTHAI'S OWN

Right — Coat by WACKO MARIA, trousers by VANS, socks by NEIGHBOURHOOD, shoes by ROA, chain and watch SLOWTHAI'S OWN

ST—Send me something.

TC—At least I’m back producing, I stopped producing for five months. I literally stopped making beats for five months because I was, I just wasn’t making music but now I’m back.

ST—So what, have you got stuff there?

TC—I’m starting again.

ST—Save me some stuff man.

TC—Do I look pregnant?

ST—You are pregnant, man.

TC—Is it yours?

ST—I guess so.

TC— What the fuck? You nutted in me, bro? Pause!

ST—You earned that.

TC—You weird, you fucking nutted in me, you a weirdo.

ST—When you was asleep man.

TC—When I was asleep!

ST—You didn’t even know I was there, I was a phantom.

TC—What the fuck?

ST—A phantom, a phantom menace.

TC—Oh man.

ST—It’s either mine or Bono’s. You decide.

TC—Well, this call has been great, you’re a doll. Everyone, thanks for setting this up. I am going to go outside and enjoy this beautiful sunlight and wear my brown.

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