Daniel Caesar's Leap of Faith

Shirt ACNE STUDIOS, pants WILLY CHAVARRIA, shoes CAMPERLAB, jewelry TALENT'S OWN. 

While much of Never Enough was created during Caesar's isolation on a remote farm in Canada amid the pandemic, the creative framework came to him while on a boat in the south of France. During that boat trip, he overheard a conversation where someone uttered the two-word phrase. Its meaning was already echoing in his head before he could articulate it. "Never enough," he says, sitting across from me on the velvet slate-gray wrap-around couch in the center of his studio.

He recalls feeling frustrated on that boat, grappling with the idea that something was never enough, but he couldn't pinpoint exactly what. The yearning to understand the meaning of these two words and what "enough" meant to him eventually revealed itself as the central drive of this album.

As an independent artist, intuition has always been integral to his music, both sonically and emotionally. Even though he is now signed to a record label, this aspect of his craft remains true. "It has to sound like me," he says, very seriously, before bursting into laughter about the album's naming. The tracklist evolved through three iterations in Canada, Los Angeles, and New York City before Caesar realized that he could continue to perfect the album or put a stop to his nitpicking, close this chapter, and move on. Never Enough is an ode to human insatiability, the innate human desire for more, and the realization that exactly where you're at is just as fine.

Get to know the Toronto native a little better below.

It’s been a while since you released a full studio album. How are you? What have you been up to the last few years?

It's been really great. Kind of like a roller coaster, but fun overall. I traveled a lot, saw a lot of places, met a lot of people.

Where did you go?

Majorca, Sudan, Jamaica, Stockholm, Copenhagen, Paris, Berlin — so many places.

When during that time did you start working on Never Enough?

2019 as soon as the world locked down, I was like, I got to do something, so I built a semi-studio in my house, and I just started cooking away.

This also feels like a new chapter for you in terms of tone, subject matter and production. What would you say defined this shift?

Joining a new label; heartbreak; breakups. I went through a lot of cycles before I settled somewhere that I felt was fair — moving forward but also giving people what I feel they want from me — to not alienate anybody.

How did lockdown impact your creative process?

A lot, because I was isolated, so in the beginning there’s definitely this hopeless feeling to the album. I’d have to look again but it feels as if it starts out hopeless with moments of despair throughout that lead into a gradual optimism at the end.

The title seems to evoke that initial hopelessness, which I, and I'm sure many others, experienced as well. How did you decide on those two words as the name for such a monumental project?

I think I was on a boat in Saint-Tropez at the time, doing mushrooms, and I was complaining about something, I don't know. I said, “It's never enough for this person or these people.” I can’t remember what it was, but a boat floated by, and it was called Never Enough. Then we started talking with the people on the boat, and they said they were from North York, which is basically Toronto. It's down the street from me, part of the GTA area, so that was just this full-circle moment.

Almost like synchronicity?

Yeah, exactly. 

Aside from France, were there any other significant places you visited that influenced your perspective over the last couple of years?

Jamaica, New York, and probably Stockholm.

Part of your family's from Jamaica right? What about being there?

I love Jamaica. My father's side is from Jamaica. The first time I got to go, I'd only gone as a child, and then probably three or four years ago, I started going as an adult by myself. I brought my girlfriend at the time, and we just kind of did whatever we wanted — it was a completely different experience.

I understood myself, you know what I mean? I love it so much. They're so honest and emotional.

Jacket and jeans CALVIN KLEIN, gloves AIREI, sunglasses GENTLE MONSTER, shoes UGG, jewelry TALENT'S OWN.

When you feel inspired, do you immediately write a song down or let it play in your head until you find the right words?

Sometimes. Usually, if it's a strong inclination, I'll stop everything and grab a pen, or I'll pull up my Notes app. But usually, I'll have something slow cooking. Music is always flowing in my mind, which is why I was in my producer bag for a minute, but I also had writer’s block for a while. I think because of my lifestyle, being on my phone all the time… listening to podcasts. It's like, ugh. My inner monologue has been a little corrupted, so I'm trying to clean it up. It's either negative, “You're not doing enough, you're not doing this, you're not doing that… they want you to do this, they want you to do that” or reminding myself to stay focused. I pontificate too much all the time. I think that the lyrics are finally coming back to me.

How much of this album did you produce?

All of it. I played 80% of the instruments, all the bass on the album, most of the guitars, and most of the keys, but I also had Dylan Wiggins in there with me. I needed his guidance for sure. Although I know what I'm doing, sometimes my confidence isn't all the way there in that sphere. He's a better musician than me by far, but I have a clear vision, and I know how I want all the parts to sound. It helped to have someone else in that seat though. I’d ask “Yo, you want to play this?” Then he’d be like, “Nah man, you got this. Just sit and figure it out.” When he does make a decision that I don’t agree with, that's when I finally start to understand what I imagined. I definitely needed that push. Just someone to be there and believe in me.

Was the creative process more intuitive or collaborative?

It started out intuitive then turned more collaborative. I think that's important, especially working with a label. I woke up to that over time.

How do you make sure that what you create still feels like you?

I fight for myself, I’ve got to, but I also believe in compromise within reason. I'm pretty self-aware so I know I'm difficult naturally. What I create does still feel like me though, but like a packaged version, or else things would be even more chaotic than they sometimes already can be. Still, I fight to be myself every day.

Do you ever ask yourself, “Does this fit?”

I try to stay open-minded, but it's more like, “Is this me?” Am I telling the truth, or am I lying?

Is that what you think makes your music so relatable — the honesty?

I think so. Part of making songs people can relate to is accepting that you’re not special despite wanting so badly to be. I'm singing about my own personal experience, trying to be unashamed of getting specific because everyone has felt what I feel. Although I feel like the only one, that's not true.

Jacket and pants HOMME PLISSÉ ISSEY MIYAKE, shirt CALVIN KLEIN, shoes DRIES VAN NOTEN, gloves, AIREI, jewelry TALENT'S OWN.

As someone who has been in the music industry for a while now and transitioned from being an independent artist to being with a label, has there been an underlying pressure to create?

I put the pressure on myself, honestly. There is a pull to put things out, but there’s more of a pull to get things together I guess because making the music is not difficult. It's everything else around it. It's marketing and presenting it to the world in a package that becomes stressful because sometimes I have to change what I like. My musical tastes are stable, but so broad, and what I like aesthetically and visually changes so much because I'm around so many cool people that are into cool things.

Do you ever struggle with perfection?

Yes, and fear.

How do you get away from it?

I jump. When I finally close a chapter on something I'm never quite happy with it. You know what I mean? For example, I could keep perfecting this album for another five years, but I’ve accepted that it’s time to let it be. It’s also so different from anything you’ve put out.

Do you ever worry that your audience is expecting something similar from you?

Yeah, I do and I rebel against it of course as with all things, but I also try to accept it. I oscillate between the two and try to land somewhere in the middle. But yeah it's very different. That's why I love that Jay-Z line. He's like, "N—s want my old shit, buy my old albums." You know what I mean?

For sure. CASE STUDY 01 and Freudian will always be there, even if people listen to this new one, they can always go back. When did you finally say, “All right, this is done; I can't do anything to it”?

I want to say six to eight months ago at this point. I basically knew I was done and agreed to a date. That was a battle because I have personally always thought that an album should never have more than 10 songs, but I just end up with so many – I'm at 15 now.

Shirt, pants and shoes ACNE STUDIOS, jewelry TALENT'S OWN.

You mentioned heartbreak earlier, which comes through especially in your singles “Valentina” and “Let Me Go,” with their general sense of longing. How would you describe heartbreak?

It’s not always so happy-go-lucky all the time. I guess that explains the nihilistic tone throughout the album. It’s like you get hurt, and then you're like, “All right, how am I going to operate in the world now? I believed in things I don’t believe in anymore.”

Would you say Never Enough brings us through that reflection?

Exactly. Yeah, it's a whole story for sure. When sequencing an album, I try and tell a story. I think that's the most important thing, but it always has to end optimistically, because I have a superstition that I kind of live out what I write. You know what I mean? Maybe not always literally, but for the most part.

Oh, really? Which comes first? The song or the lived experience?

It's like there are moments all the time when I will—it's so fucking corny. I do this in my head; I don't do this out in the world, but I’ll live through a moment and quote something I wrote in a previous album to myself, kind of like, oh. And then I realize it's kind of like everything's just cyclical, and I probably find myself in similar situations all the time because of my habits.

For sure, I feel like it’s the same with all things, just like love and heartbreak is part of the same cycle.

Yeah, it’s definitely cycles, which is what the last album was about. It’s all things always, but as an individual, singular being, you can only exist as one thing at a time, although all things are always simultaneously happening. You just go through seasons.

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Do you see yourself ever going back to writing love songs?

Recently, I found myself in another crush. I haven't had a crush like this in a long time. People were trying to push me into writing love songs for this last album, and I couldn't because I wasn’t in love. At least not new love. I was in a post-honeymoon phase of love, like, oh, I love this person but at the same time, I can't stand them.

That pull toward being close to what you desire and then once you get there, the excitement’s over.

Exactly. Yeah, this pedestal thing. It especially comes through with my first album, it's like I idealized the person that I was with. I treated them as if they were God, which is so unhealthy, but it is what I do. I feel like a lot of people can relate to that, the initial infatuation especially. Yeah for sure. And it’s like I felt this feeling before, I’m addicted to it so I try to find it again.

Are you already writing songs based on this new love?

I literally wrote a song this morning. I could see myself making another great love song honestly… I think I'm doing that right now. And I don't want to say I’m over this album, but I'm already onto the next thing and I'm excited for what's to come. I changed so much, so fast, so it's like I'm already over this. What's the next sound? What's the next aesthetic?

I feel that, I mean there’s the album, the pre-tour you just announced, the actual tour, what else is coming?

Definitely more of everything. More production, more songs. I want to go through a period of high output, so I'm going to do the whole thing — drop the album, the tour, TV performances, but I also want to do mixtapes and other albums. I was gone for a while, but I don't want to do that again. I have a lot to say. I just have to divide it all up to have complete, coherent thoughts and stay focused.

Are you looking forward to going on tour this time around?

Extremely excited. I think it’s going to be sick. I’m really excited to just be on the move again. It's like an adventure. It's really the kicker for tours — adventure. The performances are great, but it's waking up in a new city, meeting new people, doing new things.

What's your favorite part?

In the beginning, all of it. At the end of every tour, I always say, "I'll never do it again," but for the first three quarters, I love it. My favorite has to be the little romances. I’m always looking for inspiration.

If there's a lesson in all of this, what do you hope your people ultimately take away from your output this year?

That life keeps going and if you really love something, keep doing it, and take everything seriously, but also not too seriously. Live in the moment, and if you're not happy with something, it doesn't help you or anybody else to let that get you off what you're meant to do. You have to accept that there’s something you aren’t pleased with, and you're very capable of doing something you are pleased with. In the end, always keep trying to impress yourself.